During last nights class the brother of one of my students came in about 30 minutes into the class while we were doing stances. I greeted him and he said he just wanted to watch and took a seat.
I could see the scorn on his face the whole time. He stayed for about ten minutes, then left at the first drinks break. My student went outside with him, and on her return said he was passing comments like "what sort of a stance is that" and generally belittling the style. She informed me he did kickboxing

Ive found this attitude common amongst a lot of martial artists. Some seem to train purely to be a tough guy. To me they are missing the point entirely. I read an article in a magazine where a very experienced practicioner said that when different styles bicker with each other, potential students are turned off by this and the entire martial arts genre loses new blood. I guess at least he (the kickboxer) had the courtesy to do it outside.

Alas - I have seen this amongst gkr students also. At the Australian Championships in Melbourne last year there was, at the venue, a class of Tae Kwon Do taking place in full view of everyone. These were all black belt students, and their standard was impressive. I felt it reflected badly on GKR to hear our students criticising them and their style.

I agree.

Having been a practionioner of both GKR and Rhee Tae Kwon Do I have seen the attitude you describe over the past 20 years.

I don't think there will ever be a solution (not that one was sought). The only thing we can do is promote martial arts in the positive way and hope it brushes of on some of these "macho" martial art practioners.

i agree as well...

when i was in primary school i did a little bit of training in martial arts... when my uncle found out that i was training he did nothing but brag about how much his style was better
he always told me that i wasnt going to learn anything worth using there and i should quit and start learning a "real" style...
my mum ended up pulling me out of it all together just before my second grading because she noticed i was getting a little unmotivated...

it took me years to get the courage to try something again... i thought everyone was going to be just like him
my uncle doesnt know im doing karate now and im not going to tell him either.
i dont think i can handle any more of that...
i like karate

but this time im not letting anyone trick me into thinking im not doing something that is worth while...

I have found that the reason most people give when asked WHY their style is better is "Because it is".

Some will give actual reasons which are usually based on their perceptions of what you do compared to what they do. If you count responses like "they teach you how to actually fight, not pretend fight" as real reasons.

Anyway, there is not a lot you can do to change someone's opinion and most of the time it is not even worth trying.

Like some people I know who don't need to do karate cos they do tae bo/body combat/aeroboxing/whatever their particular gym calls their aerobics class.


Mick

In reply

I find that most people put down what they dont know about and advocate for what they know about, and lets face it we cant all know every style.

My challenge for the senseis out there is, to produce students who can confidntly advocate for the strenghths and weaknesses of their own style of martial arts as well as embrace the different strenghts and weaknessess other styles may have. Only then can attain mutual respect amongst "martial artists".

A wise person once told me, "you can't change somebody elses behaviour you can only change your own" try it.

:Connie rolleyes2:

Any style has strengths and weaknesses which you will see in the new students. But in any style as you progress and become more proficient you learn to overcome those weaknesses.

For example, tai chi is a martial art and although the moves are generally slow (or you could say controlled) if you were to become proficient at it and learn the applications of the moves then you could reach the point where you are able to use it in defence of self.

So while one style may suit a particular person more than another in the beginning, at the end there is no better style.


Mick

A lot of freestyle martial artists get their butts kicked in tournaments by GKR competitors. Why? Because we spend time developing strength and technique with line drills and funny-looking stances.

Kancho recently took 23 senior senseis over to Japan to meet the highest practitioners of the GoJu style, one of the two styles that was incorporated into GKR. Despite initial uncertainty on behalf of the Japanese masters, several of whom were considerably more experienced than Kancho, the GKR people were soon warmly welcomed and made to feel like honoured guests everywhere they went. One of the reasons for this, was that the Japanese recognised how close our teaching methods are to their own, and how highly we value respect for all. To receive high praise like this from Masters in the birthplace of martial arts, is indeed a great honour, and if you ever doubt the value of GKR again, just remember this story.

Kick boxing is a lively sport, which doubtless offers many benefits, not least the high levels of fitness required of its practitioners, and the level of body conditioning developed. Personally, I'd sooner stand in a funny stance, make the block, and not need the conditioning, but that's just me...

Anyway, any martial artist who is too bigoted and small minded to understand the potential value of all martial arts styles, is not really someone who's respect I much care to earn.

Sensei Grant West, senior instructor for region 28 was one of those fortunate to go on that trip. At training wednesday he used examples fom the classes he had done to stress points during basics, and passed on quite a bit of what he had learned. It was an excellent class. One story was of 30 year Goju veterans in sanchin dachi channelling power from blows & kicks down through their body into the floor without the slightest foot movement. We practiced it....I have a long way to go

Oh yes we went through some of the things he learned and saw in Japan at the last BB class. Some of it is so simple yet has never been brought up before AFAIK.

Hmm practice I must.


Mick

Aye, sanchin dachi is one of those stances that I'm never very happy with. Any of the stances with hip tucks in make me nervous. I don't like to counter the natural curvature of my spine for long having ruptred it snowboarding. It hurts and I think it's probably not good for you. In any case, isn't a curve a stronger shape than a straight line?

Like the idea of force redirection though. Absorb the blow and dissipate the energy elsewhere. How was the principle taught?

I'll see if I can get this right......

The stance is relaxed, rather than the way I was traditionally taught of everything under tension the whole time. When the blow strikes then tense everything, pushing hips forward and stomach muscles in ('knotted' if you like), and drop the stance down lower, pushing any backwards momentum downwards rather than backwards, and being careful not to lean forward into the blow. Timing the dropping of the stance to the exact moment was the trick, and it felt weird being in sanchin and not tense.

Very sad to see the attitudes have not changed much.
I am constantly disheartened by people bad mouthing other styles. It goes against things I believe anyone should learn in any style - humility, respect, tolerance..... How can we grow into good black belts if we can't develop basic traits like these?
*sigh* Sometimes I am ashamed to say I train in any style at all.

I say: ... stick to badmouthing your own style!

You cant really compare two different martial arts. The class probably did look crap to him but thats only because he is contidioned to expect one thing.

What im doing would look crap too alot of GKR ppl. They would say the stances are high and weak and the katas look crap. Neither is correct. The stances are high, but they are actually stronger than GKR ones due to the depth at which they are taught.

The katas are not crap...but you wouldnt win any tournaments with them!

Of course it is entirely possible thats mat's class is simply pants!

Matb, I dont really see how GKR is anything like Goju-kai, could you expand please?

*whispers to Rancer* simply pants?
The visual images this brings are just too much ......

Really must point out that this thread is over two years old, and is in fact one of the first threads of this forum. Matb (gkrkarate.org) hasnt visited us for quite a while but would be interested in how his opinions have changed also.

My initial sentiments stand - I detest seeing practictioners slagging off other styles. The entire genre loses.

I think this is the problem with the world in general - too many people think their way is the only way and that everyone else is wrong...

A few examples?

Colonialisation by the British, French, Spanish and Portuguese
Ethnic Cleansing in the Baltics and other nations
The President of the USA

If everyone was more tolerant we would learn more, grow more and improve our lives more - which generally I believe are the underlying philosophy of Karate and other Martial Arts.

Here endeth the lesson