Hi Folks,
I was going to turn this into a poll, put I think we can get abit out of this!
When should a student think about teaching others?
When his senior intructor says he/she's ready?
When the student feels he/she has something to teach?
When the student has a black belt?
Any thoughts on this?
Full Version: When to Teach?
You probably have a good idea of my views on this already:-)
What I was less than eloquently trying to say yesterday is that to be a good teacher you first need to be a good student. But if you begin teaching too early you're simply taking away time in which you could have been training yourself - so you won't be as good a student as you could be.
Its true that you can actually learn much by teaching, but I think you need to be a fair way along the learning process yourself in order to do that. The two ways of learning are quite different (your own training is primarily neuromuscular in nature, in teaching others you learn much more through observation). The physical (neuromuscular) phase must come before the intellectual (observation) phase for the latter to have any value.
So I'd say dan grade is a minimum requirement (unless under very exceptional circumstances). Generally speaking it should be when your own instructor thinks your ready - but that presupposes that your own instructor understands and cares about these things himself. If he/she is primarily motivated by money (and will profit by you running a club) then there is always the temptation to push you into teaching too early.
Mike
What I was less than eloquently trying to say yesterday is that to be a good teacher you first need to be a good student. But if you begin teaching too early you're simply taking away time in which you could have been training yourself - so you won't be as good a student as you could be.
Its true that you can actually learn much by teaching, but I think you need to be a fair way along the learning process yourself in order to do that. The two ways of learning are quite different (your own training is primarily neuromuscular in nature, in teaching others you learn much more through observation). The physical (neuromuscular) phase must come before the intellectual (observation) phase for the latter to have any value.
So I'd say dan grade is a minimum requirement (unless under very exceptional circumstances). Generally speaking it should be when your own instructor thinks your ready - but that presupposes that your own instructor understands and cares about these things himself. If he/she is primarily motivated by money (and will profit by you running a club) then there is always the temptation to push you into teaching too early.
Mike
QUOTE (WombatOneSix @ Apr 30 2007, 12:13 PM) 
Hi Folks,
I was going to turn this into a poll, put I think we can get abit out of this!
When should a student think about teaching others?
**A student may be naturally gifted in teaching and that shouldnt be quashed at any level. That said, however, one can only teach what one has themselves learned. **
When his senior intructor says he/she's ready?
**If the instructor feels that said person knows a particular move then no problem**
When the student feels he/she has something to teach?
**No, not feels. Only when he/she DOES have something**
When the student has a black belt?
**Most students would rather be under the tuition of a well deserved blackbelt. I feel I have enough knowledge to teach to a degree. However. I've far far more to learn before I can even say that I'm good. Perhaps one should consider learning enough before even contemplaiting holding a class?
Thats my opinion anyway **
Any thoughts on this?
I was going to turn this into a poll, put I think we can get abit out of this!
When should a student think about teaching others?
**A student may be naturally gifted in teaching and that shouldnt be quashed at any level. That said, however, one can only teach what one has themselves learned. **
When his senior intructor says he/she's ready?
**If the instructor feels that said person knows a particular move then no problem**
When the student feels he/she has something to teach?
**No, not feels. Only when he/she DOES have something**
When the student has a black belt?
**Most students would rather be under the tuition of a well deserved blackbelt. I feel I have enough knowledge to teach to a degree. However. I've far far more to learn before I can even say that I'm good. Perhaps one should consider learning enough before even contemplaiting holding a class?
Thats my opinion anyway **
Any thoughts on this?
Just to follow up on pleb's comments, it's worth differentiating between teaching in one's own right and helping someone in a class that is being run by an instructor.
I think its perfectly acceptable for one student to help another in class, at the request of the instructor. But it should be understood that this is requested by an instructor who knows whether student A really is in a position to help student B along, and also the actual instructor is never very far away so everything is still really been done under their supervision.
My earlier comments are specifically with regard to people teaching in their own right, not just being an informal sempai at the request of their instructor.
Mike
I think its perfectly acceptable for one student to help another in class, at the request of the instructor. But it should be understood that this is requested by an instructor who knows whether student A really is in a position to help student B along, and also the actual instructor is never very far away so everything is still really been done under their supervision.
My earlier comments are specifically with regard to people teaching in their own right, not just being an informal sempai at the request of their instructor.
Mike
QUOTE (mike flanagan @ Apr 30 2007, 09:10 PM)
Just to follow up on pleb's comments, it's worth differentiating between teaching in one's own right and helping someone in a class that is being run by an instructor.
I think its perfectly acceptable for one student to help another in class, at the request of the instructor. But it should be understood that this is requested by an instructor who knows whether student A really is in a position to help student B along, and also the actual instructor is never very far away so everything is still really been done under their supervision.
My earlier comments are specifically with regard to people teaching in their own right, not just being an informal sempai at the request of their instructor.
Mike
I think its perfectly acceptable for one student to help another in class, at the request of the instructor. But it should be understood that this is requested by an instructor who knows whether student A really is in a position to help student B along, and also the actual instructor is never very far away so everything is still really been done under their supervision.
My earlier comments are specifically with regard to people teaching in their own right, not just being an informal sempai at the request of their instructor.
Mike
actually i think their are 3 levels.
1. taking a few student ala Mike's sempai example
2. good level nidan/ shodan with some support not necessary a organisation maybe a few senior people to share ideas etc start small and see what happens.
3. going it alone own style whatever - you better have some serious knowledge or McDojo here you come
so my opion if its worth anything.
Wait untill at least shodan/ nidan have some support then at yondan or say 15 years min go nuts im sure you will figure it out.
Now the grades dont always mean anything, Mike i believe dosent claim any seriously high grade but has the experience and drive to experiment to see what works. i would question a lot of higher grades having similar experience but every school and person is different.
So what im saying is get a black belt then their are a lot of ifs!!
freeky
Mike said what I was going to say.. Stupid university puter grr
QUOTE (Sionnagh @ Apr 30 2007, 09:48 PM)
Mike said what I was going to say.. Stupid university puter grr
Sionnagh said that mike said what I was going to say!
I did the Sempai training course as an orange belt and ended up with my own class at green belt. This was way too soon. My own training suffered. I stressed out and students moved on. (Don't blame them.)
However, I have now been teaching for about 2 1/2 years. I'd say it took me a full year before I felt like I knew what I was doing. I also needed a lot of support for that first year.
Recently, I had one of my more confident yellow belts teach white belts their first kata. Interestingly, they all picked it up quickly. I think this is because the yellow belt kept it simple. I know I would have said too much.
There is definitely a case for students helping each other in class. There are occasions, however, when it just adds to the confusion. So Sensei supervision is recommended.
I personally think that being a Sempai is a rewarding experience as long as (a) you stay a Sempai for at least 12 months before taking your own class and (b) you are mentored by your Sensei during that year and beyond.
Bottom line - I don't agree with the policy of using color belts as branch Senseis but it is a reality in GKR. I also think there is a huge variation in the abilities of people to teach at various belt levels. So generalising may downgrade those colored belt Senseis who are really good teachers (I had one).
However, I have now been teaching for about 2 1/2 years. I'd say it took me a full year before I felt like I knew what I was doing. I also needed a lot of support for that first year.
Recently, I had one of my more confident yellow belts teach white belts their first kata. Interestingly, they all picked it up quickly. I think this is because the yellow belt kept it simple. I know I would have said too much.
There is definitely a case for students helping each other in class. There are occasions, however, when it just adds to the confusion. So Sensei supervision is recommended.
I personally think that being a Sempai is a rewarding experience as long as (a) you stay a Sempai for at least 12 months before taking your own class and (b) you are mentored by your Sensei during that year and beyond.
Bottom line - I don't agree with the policy of using color belts as branch Senseis but it is a reality in GKR. I also think there is a huge variation in the abilities of people to teach at various belt levels. So generalising may downgrade those colored belt Senseis who are really good teachers (I had one).
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