Well - just went thru all the changes....not so bad for everything except sepai - which really copped the treatment.
Must say some of them make a lot of sense. There seems to be a swing towards making techniques more like the basic techniques (mawashi empi's instead of a "round rising elbow strike", and converting the bassai dai "narrow" long stance into a proper one), and also making them somewhat more practical in application (not turning side on in sepai and pushing opponent away rather than blocking).

Its a bugger getting out of old habits, especially with the removal of that sodding "half step" in Bassai dai. I spent so long getting out of the full step habit, now doing it just seems so ...wrong!!

thoughts??

I dunno, I sometimes wonder how many are changes and how many are corrections. Though there is only 1 change to bassai dai - at least compared to how I first learnt it. About 4 though from how it has been done in recent times.

It's not so bad, I've been practicing the changes for the last couple of months - thanks to some friends over east and in the UK who seem to have much better access to the higher people in the club than us lowly westerners.

Though I am sure there will be more corrections once the new videos come out - not long now.

Only thing that makes me wonder is how everything (application-wise) is couched in terms of an attack from another karateka when it is not necessarily so.


Mick

How about telling us the changes starting from the beginning!!
And just how far off are the original videos from how the new katas are?

It would be far easier for your instructor to show you the changes than try to describe them. And if you buy the old videos so that you can then buy the new ones your SRI will love you for taking them off his hands. (Don't buy them, that was a joke)


Mick

That's ok, I've already got all the old videos. I don't pay much attention to the changes anyway 'cause the katas usually get changed back again. My senior instructor doesn't know the changes yet. He's waiting for the new videos to come out like the rest of us I reckon

I only have to make a few changes to my katas coz i only know up to bassai dai. But I must admit that the full step in bassai dai will take a bit of getting used to.

I only have to make a few changes to my katas coz i only know up to bassai dai. But I must admit that the full step in bassai dai will take a bit of getting used to.

But if you think about it the full step makes sense cos you need a deep enough entry to apply the takedown.


Mick

Oh wait, that's the step before.


Mick

Ok, so what do you all think about the changes/corrections/improvments, to all the differant kata, do agree/disagree, like/dislike them, personally they all make sense now if you know the bunkai to go with it, which will be on the videos.

I tend to agree here with someone I tend to regard as something of a guide or mentor...

If the applications are defences against lunge punch, front kick etc (ie basic karate-type attacks) then they're probably not realistic.

Wait for the videos themselves... I'd put money that there are more corrections to come.


Mick

So does anyone know when the new vids will be out?

In about a month, or so I hear...


Mick

We are looking forward to it...


Bearette

HI
I too have the old vids, but i don't watch them too often. I am currently trying to learn Bassai myself; i know a bit early as i've just gone green belt but i feel as i need to learn them ( not complaining though as my sensei says i don't need to know it yet) anyway whats the short step thats been mentioned, i know of the shuffle with the lunge punch - about move 22 as i've been told one change and its not that one; its one before the kick where you turn around. :thumbgrin:

That'd be the one, it used to be a drop of the hand to inside the rear knee then push forward and up under the elbow and out into a reinforced kake uke as you shifted from kokutsu dachi (back stance) into an inline zenkutsu dachi (front stance). Now the hand moves straight from the stomach out to the elbow for the kake uke, and the front foot steps across and you convert to normal zenkutsu dachi.

The most obvious application for this part is a wrist lock, at the moment it's one of my favourites.


Mick

Hi! I haven't surfed these sites for a while, but I still see the same questions pop up.

The Kata changes seemed "ho-hum" when I trained with GKR last (couple of months now).

The Bassai Dai changes are an attempt to try and align the Kata with that of the IKF - why? There's an Olympics coming up, and GKR practitioners will never be seen in the Olympics, because GKR isn't a recognised style/club/federation etc by any International body, and GKR practitioners will never be able to compete in the Olympics unless GKR gets recognised or they cross train with another club.

The Step across into full Zenkutsu Dachi is (IMO) the wrong way - everyone else steps the back foot across, not the front foot. The full step up at the end of the Kata is true, and should never have been used in the first place.

Sepai changes: the "Oliver Uke" as it's known, should not have been changed, as it represented a true Bunkai - maybe the change occurred because no one could work out a good enough interpretation.

Anyway, any new interpretation you learn is a good one, and should be added to your arsenal of techniques. The more you know the better, so absorb it, accept and keep learning.

Hope to see you again soon, cheers!

CraigL

Sounds like you no longer train GKR Craig. Must admit Olympics has never actually occurred to me before, and I'd be surprised if it has to anyone else. Is Karate now an event? If so what part? Taekwondo have the full contact sparring already. Kata? Well that'd be exciting to the man in the street compared to two blokes beating each other up. Another full contact event? Kyokushin and the like would have that stitched up anyway. If karate does become an event thered be a lot of styles that couldnt compete. The same way that unless you train with a school registered with Taekwondo Australia you are not eligible for olympic selection, even though you and your school may be registered with the world body in Korea!

Politics and sport eh?

While Im on my soap box that phrase "Oliver uke" really shits me. Its a blitz block and we used to do it all the time

I tend to agree CraigL about the "Oliver uke" in sepai, only the preparation ought to have been changed IMO.

But how is "blitz block" better than "Oliver uke"? Besides I have heard the techniques described as "open hand gedan barai" and "shotei oshi"


Mick

Exactly my point Sionnagh.
"Oliver Uke" always implied it was invented by a GKR practitioner, when in all truth he just grabbed it from another style.

me i just wish they would make there minds up and set the kata's to that patten, that shouldn't be to hard should it? .has anyone got any idea how many times the third kata (sorry cann't find the spelling for the name of it) has been changed.

Actually I believe saifa (3rd kata) hasn't been changed in many many moons. Most of the time "changes" would be more correctly identified as "corrections".

But that's the problem you face when people are teaching kata before they have learnt it properly themselves.

knocking on...


Mick

ok thanks they must have stopped changing it when i had my 2 years off and guess what i decide to start again and you guessed it yep it's changing again.

oh and one other thing about the siafa (thankyou for the spelling) kata i only ever learnt that kata of my sensei's or region manager but i did pratise with other students maybe that's where the ''corrections'' come from

Gotta wonder how long itll be before the variations start creeping back in and we go through this all again

Well at least no one will be making "changes" or "improvements" to kata like taigyoku shodan and taigyoku nidan. Those two feel perfectly tuned how they are now. But maybe they'll change the kicks in nidan for jumping kicks, and the ounches for double punches.

Certainly adds improvement to the kata. More power!

lol plse don't give them ideas i can handle the double punches no problem, but the jumping kicks i'm still trying to work them out i always seem to end up on the dojo floor (not a pretty sight then again i am a ugly son of a gun anyway )

Bah, jumping kicks are easy. It's the jumping side kicks that are insanely hard.

lol ok so do tell how do i manage to stay upright after a jumping kick, i'm always looking at the roof of the dojo at the end of one

...I have no clue. I didn't think the idea was to flip yourself backwards as you do it. All it is is jumping straight up, forcing one knee up as you go, then perform a Mae Geri while in the air with the other leg.

Easy.

I was shown a few times how to do flying side kicks, but I don't have the skill to tuck one foot underneath, while kicking out with the other.

ok i can do that now for the next one the one that i end up looking at the dojo roof with, the forward jumping front kick i take it you jump forward of the back foot? now what foot to kick with so i actually land on my feet lol. i'd love a tip on this one to if possible please

Best way to do jumping kicks is to step back foot forward and pretend you're stepping on a box.
Then kick with the other leg as normal while the first leg stays raised.

Coupla practices and it gets easy :thumbgrin:

cool ty now to pratise it and hopfully get it right